Of course are media and code copyrightable. MIT and CC-BY-4.0 are widely used and common open source licenses. I don’t get why this is “ubious and off-feeling”.
Also, Not actually the bare minimum has a slightly different focus than Void. It is a base for building own games, while Void is meant a testing ground for mods.
What I meant is that the code is minimal, and the media is simple shapes, the latter is very likely too simple for copyright law to apply, and the former it could be argued is trivial too, but dismissing licenses for software has always been an iffy area.
(part one of two)
i guess, to get things rolling, replying to the orginal review. personally, at this time i disagree with orginally post, and much perfer void game as a good testing base and also to start making a game with. usually i end up replacing all of void anyways, but its a good launcher when i want to start adding some content first without getting nodes for mapgen, etc at the start.
normally, wouldnt have even bothered to respond, and while i disagree i think the olive has a perfectly valid point and one that probably works for a lot of people, just not me. however i am responding because:
(part two of two)
1. i really, really dont want to get into a licensing debate, but i think at the basics we all agree you cant copyright an if statement for example. the question then becomes at what point does a code snippet stop being trival and become copyrightable? well grabbing some results from el search engine, https://www.ictrecht.nl/en/blog/what-is-the-license-status-of-stackoverflow-code-snippets#:~:text=As a rule of thumb,law I'm aware of. sure void game is more than a few lines, but its also the lines of code almost every game ever is going to have in it. the detractors might say, but we got you here, if your using void games modnames thats not going to be in every game. well, im looking at this through the lense of cdb (am a staff member after all - this however is my opinion) you have to namespace your mods in a game which removes that very arguement.
with all the above said however, i do personally think that, despite whatever your personal choice and flavor of the licensing wars, a copy left on the computer, on the server, in the public domain, credit only, credit and protect trade names, that simple example code like this if it needs to have a license, should be licensed under 0BSD or some other simple license where people can do whatever with it with worry/care. however this is just my opinion and this is not my package, so the author is free to do whatever they want
2. dont want to ruffle to many feathers, but the response seems to be quite antagonistic (in my opinon) and when followed up in good faith attempt to try and get parts removed from it. while the one liner seems weak, i considered adding additional sentenances, however as this is a personal comment ill leave it at that
in discussing with someone else, but im far to lazy now to write this out in a good way, apis generally arent copyrightable, and all this is using the most common api code any game will have. ill let the reader investigate this angle more fully
"Uncopyrightable" was a red herring. It was never relevant here. Obviously this package is non-trivial and legally protected. The original review even only suggests "it could be argued", not that it is BEING argued, so you shouldn't put too much credence on a point the original reviewer isn't even pushing.
The argument that the game seems to be aiming for minimalism, but fails to be minimalistic in terms of licensing, whereas some other package exists that DOES have the desired minimalism there, sounds pretty valid to me.
If people are not meant to use this as a game starter kit, but only to test mods in a vacuum, then that's fine ... but a package that can do both would probably render a package that can only do one unnecessary, especially if it's licensed more usefully. I'm fairly sure that Void Game HAS been used as a game starter kit, especially for some jam games in the past. If it's not meant to be used that way, then that makes olive's review pointing people to where they should go instead for that a lot more helpful.
Since I don’t think that such a convoluted discussion about such a non-technical issue worth anything, I just relicensed the game to 0BSD for all code and documentation, and CC0 for all media.
I honestly don’t care about how you use this game :)
Thanks for this, it's useful as a testground for making mods. Very useful as a skeleton for making a non-MTG based game too!
I also recommend Not actually the bare minimum. It has slightly more there from the bat, making it a little bit nicer to use for some cases.
Of course are media and code copyrightable. MIT and CC-BY-4.0 are widely used and common open source licenses. I don’t get why this is “ubious and off-feeling”.
Also, Not actually the bare minimum has a slightly different focus than Void. It is a base for building own games, while Void is meant a testing ground for mods.
What I meant is that the code is minimal, and the media is simple shapes, the latter is very likely too simple for copyright law to apply, and the former it could be argued is trivial too, but dismissing licenses for software has always been an iffy area.
Oh well. Maybe have rambling over licensability of code and graphics in the forums and not in the reviews for a game?
The licensing is a part of my review.
(part one of two)
i guess, to get things rolling, replying to the orginal review. personally, at this time i disagree with orginally post, and much perfer void game as a good testing base and also to start making a game with. usually i end up replacing all of void anyways, but its a good launcher when i want to start adding some content first without getting nodes for mapgen, etc at the start.
normally, wouldnt have even bothered to respond, and while i disagree i think the olive has a perfectly valid point and one that probably works for a lot of people, just not me. however i am responding because:
(part two of two)
1. i really, really dont want to get into a licensing debate, but i think at the basics we all agree you cant copyright an if statement for example. the question then becomes at what point does a code snippet stop being trival and become copyrightable? well grabbing some results from el search engine, https://www.ictrecht.nl/en/blog/what-is-the-license-status-of-stackoverflow-code-snippets#:~:text=As a rule of thumb,law I'm aware of. sure void game is more than a few lines, but its also the lines of code almost every game ever is going to have in it. the detractors might say, but we got you here, if your using void games modnames thats not going to be in every game. well, im looking at this through the lense of cdb (am a staff member after all - this however is my opinion) you have to namespace your mods in a game which removes that very arguement.
with all the above said however, i do personally think that, despite whatever your personal choice and flavor of the licensing wars, a copy left on the computer, on the server, in the public domain, credit only, credit and protect trade names, that simple example code like this if it needs to have a license, should be licensed under 0BSD or some other simple license where people can do whatever with it with worry/care. however this is just my opinion and this is not my package, so the author is free to do whatever they want
2. dont want to ruffle to many feathers, but the response seems to be quite antagonistic (in my opinon) and when followed up in good faith attempt to try and get parts removed from it. while the one liner seems weak, i considered adding additional sentenances, however as this is a personal comment ill leave it at that
follow up to my own point 1 now:
in discussing with someone else, but im far to lazy now to write this out in a good way, apis generally arent copyrightable, and all this is using the most common api code any game will have. ill let the reader investigate this angle more fully
"Uncopyrightable" was a red herring. It was never relevant here. Obviously this package is non-trivial and legally protected. The original review even only suggests "it could be argued", not that it is BEING argued, so you shouldn't put too much credence on a point the original reviewer isn't even pushing.
The argument that the game seems to be aiming for minimalism, but fails to be minimalistic in terms of licensing, whereas some other package exists that DOES have the desired minimalism there, sounds pretty valid to me.
If people are not meant to use this as a game starter kit, but only to test mods in a vacuum, then that's fine ... but a package that can do both would probably render a package that can only do one unnecessary, especially if it's licensed more usefully. I'm fairly sure that Void Game HAS been used as a game starter kit, especially for some jam games in the past. If it's not meant to be used that way, then that makes olive's review pointing people to where they should go instead for that a lot more helpful.
Since I don’t think that such a convoluted discussion about such a non-technical issue worth anything, I just relicensed the game to 0BSD for all code and documentation, and CC0 for all media.
I honestly don’t care about how you use this game :)
Nice! Edited my review.
just want to say thanks for updating the licensing